Sweet listeners, are any of you grieving? This week we are joined by the effervescent Joan Price, Author of Sex After Grief and several incredible senior sex guides. She brings such kindness and wisdom to us in this episode that spans from a near death experience at 35 to losing her beloved in 2008 and finding love and connection again after. Her teachings of gratitude, living each day like it could be your last, and staying up to date on your “i love you’s” while simple and classic are incredibly potent and so well said. This conversation is incredibly rich and kind in the way it navigates grief, joy, and the ways they exist together.

See the drawing from episode: https://pin.it/4vokSg8

Find Joan’s books, teachings, and resources at her website joanprice.com

You can register for the upcoming Fire Woman Retreat May 13-16! Spend 3 days cultivating safety, connection, and joy in your sexuality with A’Magine, Sophia and many other incredible teachers! Sign up at SophiaWiseOne.com/FireWoman


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As always you can go to SophiaWiseOne.com for more information about the show, Reports from the Spider Queen, to preorder the I Love My Life Card Game and Oracle Deck, to join Sophia’s email list, and so much more!

“I am Sophia Wise One: Daughter of the Wind. I am calling you to Rise Up, Rise Up, Rise Up. Rise up and take your place.”

This content is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis, or treatment. Always seek the advice of your physician or other qualified health providers with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition.

Sophia Wise One 00:01

Fire, woman retreat, spiritual transformation, sexual initiation and power. This is a retreat that I first went to as a participant of, and now I go as a participant and a collaborator, I am inviting you to come and join me. Deepen your education, deepen your experience. It’s very experiential. I’m a very technical kind of experience based person. theory is great. And I love a good conversation, but really doing and tapping into it’s incredibly important to me. And so as community, and this event has all of these things in beautiful proportions. Can you tell I’m a fan? I’m a huge fan, please check out the link below please consider giving yourself this gift of being charged up power recent heard and supported your sexuality is sacred and important and you are capable of being of alchemical transformational power center. And if you are already those things, come in hone it come and be in deep community. For me, one of the things that was so powerful to just be in such a sex positive space allowed some of the social stigma that I knew, in theory, it was like, I don’t believe this. But it’s so grounding and so nourishing to be sitting with other people who are committed to experiencing reality in a way that is honoring and holding and sacred and pleasurable. So please, check out the link check it out, would be so happy to have you there. And feel free to reach out to me or to reach out to imagines team with any questions that you may have about it. There is a frequently asked questions at the bottom of the page. So you can go check there and see if your question is there. Okay, so much love. so grateful. Alright, and this week’s episode, here we go. I’m Samantha Rise, and welcome to Vagina Talks, where we speak about two from vaginas. This is a show of alchemy, where we turn poison into medicine, disconnection into wisdom and isolated wounds into communal peacemaking. Here’s your host, Sophia Wise One. Do you already know everything that I could do to? Do you already know everything I could say? We are here to remind you but you already, already, already know. I just want to take a minute to acknowledge that Vagina Talks understands that gender is fluid and dynamic and goes way beyond the binary of either woman or man, she or him. And that, in fact, it’s a living and evolving thing that’s actually personal person to person. And that our bodies, even our understanding, or the ways that we experience them can vary. It’s important for me that that’s something that has space here on Vagina Talks. And at the same time, I also am carrying this understanding that woman hood and the experience of the feminine and all of the female, in the splitting of that binary has been injured has been hurt has been dismantled. And so I’m looking to have a space where the feminine and the female and the female body is reclaimed and respected and lifted and inspected and known, as well as a space that goes beyond the binary. And that acknowledges that these are limited constructs mostly put upon us, and that we’re in the process of evolving into something more whole and more true. Just wanted to say that some of my guests will use incredibly binary language for whatever reason from the places that they come from. And I just wanted to let you know that Vagina Talks has a much wider understanding, and it’s a living one. So feel free to chime in as we go along. Without further ado, today’s episode. Welcome to vagina talks beloved’s I am so grateful and honored for you to be with me here again today here and with me and an amazing guest. I’m like already beside myself. I just am beside myself. I’m excited. I’m honored. What a time. What a time to be alive. I’m going to have already all over the place. Okay. I’m going to tell you a little bit about our guest. I’m going to tell you a little bit. No, where do I start? Okay. All right. I’m going to tell you, this is who it okay. Joan Price calls herself an advocate for ageless sexuality. She is the author of four books about sex and aging, including the award winning naked at our age and talking out loud about senior sex. Joan Price is a legend among sex educators for knowledge and expansion and know how around what it is to keep vitality and, and yumminess going, what it what it requires just just what she is. She also is the author of sex after grief. And there are so many books about grief, and they almost never mentioned sex. And if they do, it’s really kind of sidelines and sex after grief navigating your sexuality after losing your beloved, is the first book to address sex and grief together and treat sex as normal positive life a forming part of emerging from grief that’s a huge part of grief or vitality our sexuality. Joan is known by the media as the voice of senior sex. Her award winning blog has been offering senior sex news views and sex toys reviews since 2005. At age 77, Joan continues to talk out loud about senior sex partnered or solo people. She’s the co-creator of Jessica Drake’s guide to wicked sex, senior sex, find Joan and her books and her blog and her massive knowledge base at joanprice.com. It’s all there massive it’s a lot. It’s a resource.

Joan Price 06:17

I’m sorry, I shouldn’t be laughing at your introduction, but you surprise me. Please continue.

Sophia Wise One 06:26

She is a treasure among treasures. And she is the incomplete embodiment of, of vulnerability, grace and sexiness vitality and beauty. Joan, I am just beside myself, I have been so delighted to bring you on the show and to share you and to share your your richness with my listeners. So please welcome to the show. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome.

Joan Price 06:51

Oh, thank you. I am thrilled to be here too. I appreciate this so much.

Sophia Wise One 06:57

I am just you know, I think one of the things I want to say is one of the things that I think both of us are pretty. I was you know very specific about it being like let’s talk about sex after grief and your response being like, yeah, it’s really important. Let’s talk about that. And I just want to say like, senior sex is like, like, like, duh, like, everything in our life gets richer. And I had this epiphany when I was in my 20s, where I realized that I had thought that getting older just meant like you got less happy that I had this like on unconscious belief system that just getting older meant you got less happy. And that’s when I decided that I was like, that’s not going to be true. I’m going to get happier every year of my life. And go ahead.

Joan Price 07:42

I love that attitude. That is that is so precious. And I know that you have many years to go before you’re my age, many decades to go before you’re my age. But I hope you can keep doing that. And I hope each year you can look back and say, Yeah, I really was happier last year than the year before. And, and Yay, you go next year.

Sophia Wise One 08:06

Right? Exactly like building on it and that radical belief to like, flip that. And I so it’s been an interesting thing to have that apply. And to ask those questions as I’ve done my sexuality, like reclamation and expansion and claiming to recognize that my happiness and my creativity, my vitality, my body pleasure, my Yeah, those ripples that that’s part of that happiness. And so, you know, you coming into my life was definitely a part of reaffirming that happiness. And pleasure includes that, right that growth of just like, on and on and on and like, and I was thinking about this actually, I was just talking about you, with my with my sister before coming on. And I was just very excited about it. And, and I was saying that, Oh, I forgot where I was going with that. That’s okay. But so anyway, it’s just a great celebration. I’d love you to speak. I want I do I have questions about grief. I have questions about your story. I have questions about everything. And I also just want to say, why don’t you just take a moment, Joan and just just share what’s on your heart and mind in this moment. kind of bring yourself in a little bit if there’s a story or if I’ve stirred something, I don’t want to put you on the spot, but just an invitation to bring you in.

Joan Price 09:23

I love I love being on the spot. Okay, if you’re on the spot, it means you can have a spotlight right?

Sophia Wise One 09:30

Take it away, Joan.

Joan Price 09:32

So so what I’m thinking with what you just said, is that in my own life being 77 now and happy to say that out loud. I don’t know why people aren’t I don’t know why people think oh, no, I can’t admit how old I am. I’m so happy about how old I am. I almost died before my 35th birthday. And maybe that gives me a different perspective on why every year brings so much more joy. But it does. And here I am more than doubling the number of years that I in some ways was meant to have. And each each year has brought me more self knowledge, more knowledge about other people more understanding about what I have to give and how to give it. And, and with that, I mean, both personally and professionally, not just sexually, but in all ways. Because we are an inter woven fabric of ways we relate in the world. It isn’t just that we are a sex educator or a podcast or whatever it is. One thing is you’re focusing on, we have all of these threads and all of these patches of our past of our present I had no idea was gonna say that. Look what you bring out in me already.

Sophia Wise One 10:55

Come on in. That’s the Lynn darling.

Joan Price 10:57

This is your world right and I am tiptoeing through it.

Sophia Wise One 11:03

Welcome, welcome. So happy to have you here that. That I mean? Yeah, I mean, almost dying before the age of 35. They’ll really change perspective on what it is to be alive, I imagine. Right? So that was not a small thing. That’s a big thing.

Joan Price 11:22

It absolutely did. It was a huge thing. And part of it was really having to fight to come back to life. I made the diss You’re such a spiritual person. I know you’ll understand this and relate to it. But as I was dying, I did see my life flashing before me but not not episodically. I saw the people that I had loved, flashing before me, alive and deceased. And with each picture that flashed in front of my eyes, the question that I had to answer was, does this person know how much I love or love them? And if so, is it okay to go now? And I’m serious when you know, there was an old boyfriend, there was my mother, there were people in my life at the time there were just flashing flash flash flash. And each one I would go Yes, yes, yes. And I realized, I realized after that was done, and I decided, Okay, I could go now. But I don’t want to, I want the rest of my life. And so I came back in my body. And this is something that I don’t mind telling people about it. Although I know a lot of people will go, oh, how Whoo, you were just semi conscious and hallucinating. I don’t know. It doesn’t matter. What matters is the revelation that we do need to always be up to date in letting people know that we love them. We can’t have, well, we’ll patch up this argument tomorrow. Or I wonder if I should reconnect. And now I don’t think that person even thinks to me anymore. Whatever it is, that stops us from being up to date and sharing the love we feel for people. It is our job, I think our job as people have been living to do that in any way we can. And at the time of this automobile accident. I was a high school English teacher. And months later, when I was ready to go back to teaching, I had many, many injuries. But when I was back in teaching, I shared the story with people. And the next day, students would come into my classroom and say things like, I told my mother I loved her and she cried. I mean, a 16 year old probably hasn’t told her mother that she loved her for half a dozen year.

Sophia Wise One 14:06


Joan Price 14:08

And things like that happen. It’s like there’s a ripple. I do this and share it. Look what can happen. And in a way I you know, I feel I’m still living my life that way. What can I share that will have a ripple effect that will be a positive in people’s lives. I didn’t know I was gonna talk about that either. What did you do to me?

Sophia Wise One 14:33

How did you how do you how do you gain like clarity of self is the question that I want to say like knowing that we’re continually evolving, right that there’s a continuity of self right. There’s like, there’s a way in which it’s like yeah, I’ve always been, there’s an element that’s like this is always kind of come along with me. I found that in my own kind of massive rebirth and transformation. It’s like I’m more of myself afterwards even if there’s a lot of me that’s changed. There’s like a trueness. But this notion of like, kind of getting clear about am I current like, how do you how do you check in? Do you do that consciously? Is that just a way of being now? Is that something you do on purpose? Or is it like just woven in? How do you know if you’ve? How do you know when you need to catch? Catch it?

Joan Price 15:25

I think it’s all of those. At first, it was very deliberate. What if this was all the time I have? You know, what if this is going to be the next time that happens in this time, I won’t come back to life. So at first, it was very deliberate. And then it became a habit, it became a way that made me happy to live. Because I felt in the present, I felt authentic. I attracted people who liked that in me, and I, and the people who didn’t learn away. I mean, people went away. Let’s be clear. People went away.

Sophia Wise One 16:07


Joan Price 16:08

People who didn’t value authenticity, the way I did, or or were intimidated by the kind of communication that’s important to me to have. And I don’t mean a confrontational communication. But I mean, let’s be clear. And here’s where I am on what you just said, or did. And here’s what I’d really love and how would that work for you? There are ways to be clear, and there are ways to be. I mean, there are ways to be assertive and ways to be aggressive. And I don’t consider myself aggressive. But I, we don’t ever know how much time we have. So why don’t we live as if what we have is what we have?

Sophia Wise One 16:50


Joan Price 16:51

And then if there are things that need fixing, what are we waiting for? And I hear this from the people, my followers will sometimes Tell me. After my spouse died, I discovered all these secrets that went through his phone, whatever it might have been discovered these secrets. What could I have done differently, and they’re feeling haunted by it? Sometimes they feel my relationship was a lie. No, it wasn’t a lie, we just have secrets. And the more you can encourage people, to, to reveal themselves to be fully authentic with you will be based maybe on how you judge them, if they try it.

Sophia Wise One 17:39

Thrilled, some people.

Joan Price 17:40

Some people just won’t want to do it. And maybe they’re not the ones you want to be with. But the people who wish they could maybe that person who had secrets on his phone would have loved to tell you what those secrets were, but was scared. And in fact, the fact that in finding those secrets, you said our relationship was a lie. Maybe it was a good reason that he hid them. So I learned from so many people who confide in me what they wish they had done, or maybe what they don’t know when they don’t know what to do. And if I have good advice, or given if I just need to listen, I’ll listen. I learn all the time from the people who come to me for advice. So it’s always expanding. And I’m sure you find that too. We learn from everyone we interact with that.

Sophia Wise One 18:31

Yeah. It’s so powerful, what you’re talking about this this seat of authenticity and this notion of I just thinking about that, right? It’s like the other the flip side of coming across something and just delighting in knowing more about someone, right? And then I saw the rest of them, right? Like, I wish I could have seen more of it or to just what it is to inherently trust someone in a way so that when you find their secrets, they’re precious. Right? Like, that’s, you know, that that is what I hear. It’s like the the love story, the potential love story in that right that the, the the trusted kindness. And I was just this morning, just this morning, Joan and I was writing about, I was writing about, let’s see, I have it right here. I started, I started to draw a flower and then got very quiet and very quiet and got very still and I am taking care of one of my niblings, one of my little new babies just just eight weeks, eight weeks today.

Joan Price 19:33


Sophia Wise One 19:34

Eight weeks today, and we’re living living together, hence talking to my sister this morning like earlier. And so I have the morning shift with this little baby. And so this baby’s sleeping on my chest and I’m drawing this picture and then everything got very quiet. And then I had this epiphany and I started to write people think I’m difficult. Lovely. And still, I know this is because some people tell me when we are together, that they forgot how easy it was to be with me. It’s this like reverse reveal, like we’re together and they’re like, Oh my gosh, we always have such good conversations. Oh, I don’t have to be so put together. Like, I forgot that we had this kind of connection. And I’m like, Huh, it’s interesting, because you’re revealing that it’s, it’s this, you know, and as I wrote this, it’s got softer. It wasn’t like this notion of like, people think I’m difficult. It’s like, that’s my own projection story on time. You know, there’s like, I’m filling in a little heftier hit in there than what people are saying, but but this experience that people I know, something because of what they kind of confess in my presence, which is, oh, this is easier, this is safer. This is more different than I had, I’d remembered it being. And so I said, right, how they it’s easy conversation, they don’t need to be put together. And that it’s actually to their surprise. And I know now that it’s not me, but the lingering of difficulty of I don’t know what this word is, because I can’t read but being with themselves, authenticity remains, it is the fact the opposite. They have the challenge of self sitting with self, not the challenge of me that like some of the people in my experience, my best friend said to me, when I was a kid, she said, a long time ago, she said, it’s not that people don’t want to see you, Sophia, it’s that when people see you, and you look at them, you see them. And that’s what they are hesitant to invite to a party, not you. It’s not you, it’s them that they’re hesitant to invite to a party, they feel like they need to be in the right state of mind. And this insight brought me great relief and clarity. And today another layer of grief, a loss. And no, this deep recognition that I’ve made this commitment to authenticity, that is, is what you’re talking about that that notion of like some people are sometimes it’s just a mismatch piece. It’s not even that heavy. I don’t mean it to be judgmental of like other people, but there’s an element of people have said it to me, they’re like, I just can’t, your authenticity, it’s like the intensity is is to sit with themself is a little much. You know, I mean, I love these people, we were it was fun, you know, and that sense of just and recognizing like, and that’s okay, I’ve made that choice. And, and, and then the celebration and the reflection of the people that have come into my life that love it, right, that are just like a year for it that are so that we’re as hungry. I have my one my one teacher and friend, then we talk about we still cry about it. We met over 10 years ago now. And we still have moments where I was just saying that that I said, “Remember when we first met and we would just cry because we had felt so alone for so long?”

Joan Price 22:48

Oh, wow.

Sophia Wise One 22:50

And deep, deep spiritual is I mean, literally, my this is my reiki, my reiki master teacher who I studied years with years under her. And this was not like a weekend training of reiki, this was studying with my teacher for years. And when we found each other, we would confess these secrets and be so understood. And it was through the courage of our sharing with each other, honestly, that I have this show that I have my blog that I have the things that I’ve shared with the world is because I sat with her and shared myself and was so seen. And she said, and we knew looking at each other we said, there’s so many more of us. There’s so many more of us, but we’ve been so when you know it’s hard to find each other when we keep it secret and so that, yeah, so all those things come to mind when you talk about sharing that vulnerability, and being someone who can receive that vulnerability from others.

Joan Price 23:42

Wow, that’s really beautiful. I’d love to see that flower.

Sophia Wise One 23:47

Oh, great.

Joan Price 23:50

That started that part of the conversation.

Sophia Wise One 23:54

It’s funny, it’s a flower in movement. It’s just this is just the beginning. It’s just the beginning these singular lines and then I drew after I wrote it out, I drew these. You know how they draw those little lines, like three lines around something to show that it’s moving?

Joan Price 24:08

Yes. Yes.

Sophia Wise One 24:08

You know. I drew those around each of the petals. Which I never.

Joan Price 24:14

You can picture that.

Sophia Wise One 24:15

Yeah, I’ll take a picture. I’ll take a picture of it.

Joan Price 24:17

Oh, good.

Sophia Wise One 24:18

I’ll post I’ll post it somewhere. I like it.

Joan Price 24:20

Post it on the show notes.

Sophia Wise One 24:22

I’ll put it on the show notes. I’ll take a picture y’all can see it. Thanks for asking, Joan. That’s sweet. That’s sweet. What a sweet modeling even just that moment right now just being like, I’d like to see that. You know, that’s sweet. Sweetness. Ah. Tell Tell me something. I’m gonna say tell me something good. Tell me something. Oh, you know what, Joan, talk about putting on the spot. Tell me something promising about having the love of your life and then letting them go and still being here.

Joan Price 25:04

Hmm. So what you’re referring to is the person who is the reason that I wrote Sex After Grief. But he’s also the reason that I do this work at all. Because it was my relationship with Robert, that made me switch from a career writing about health and fitness, to writing one senior sex book, I thought that’s what I was going to do. One senior sex book, and 16 years later. This is, I mean, this has been my whole life for 16 years now is writing and speaking about senior sex and helping people in consultations, doing webinars doing presentations, it is my life, and I and it. And if I had not fallen in love with Robert, there would have been no reason to do this, I would have been where I was when I met him, which was a good place to be. But this is a better place to be, this is a fuller place to be. Now, I’m not saying I want to say and it’s a good thing, he died because then sex after grief. No, no, it’s a horrible thing that he died. But what I learned over the years since he died in 2008, is that by with through my struggle, and my grief journey, and my lean learning everything I could from grief counselors and other writers and people, other people’s experiences, that each year, I realized, I knew some things that could help some people, I would meet people who were earlier on their grief journey than I was. And I would offer something that I had learned, and it would help them and I thought, Oh, well, I can’t say this. I can’t, you know, I can’t say it’s ever a good thing that I lost the love of my life. But I can say that I’m making the most of it. Because what would he want, if he were to stand on my shoulder and say, in spiritual form, he would obviously hurt my shoulder in real form, if he did that, but in spiritual form, if you stood on my shoulder, and he said, I really love what you’re teaching other people. Now that that is why I do it. I mean, that’s one of the reasons I do it. That’s one of the things I’m aware of that. If he had well let me back up when he was dying, one of the things he said to me was, “Promise me, you’ll keep doing your work, it’s important.” And I said to him, I remember very clearly, “I’ll promise anything you want just don’t die.” And he said, “I can’t be in charge of that. But you can be in charge of what you do.” And it took me it took me a long time. Well, for me a long time, it might not have seemed like it to others, before I was ready to go back to work, but when I did, it was always with his smile and his caresses and his nod of approval. And now I’m gonna you said we could have tears. I’m having tears. I he’s always with me.

Sophia Wise One 28:26


Joan Price 28:27

And in the years since he died. And even in the years since I decided I wanted that Sex After Grief had to be written, I realized, I’ve learned so much I’ve moved on so much. Grief doesn’t end grief counts every grief counselor tell you this. You don’t get a get. You don’t get done with grief. You don’t finish grief, you don’t get out of grief. You get through it. And I saw it more as a cycle. You go round and round and round. It’s like a spiral. You go deep into it. And then you emerge for a moment you see the light or the moonlight of sunlight. And then you go back in and there’s only dark and you come back out. And as the cycle progresses, there’s more time spent in the light and less time time spent in the darkness. And as this happened to me, it doesn’t just happen automatically. You have to do the work. It’s important to do the work and to align yourself with the people for whom this is their day job. The grief counselors this is what they do. This is what they know. Please don’t hold back from don’t think you have to white knuckle it and just well be strong. I’m I’m over it. It’s a year. It’s five years I should know. Just get help whatever space you are. You’ll learn so much and then you’ll be able to choose what to internalize and what, what to let go, what doesn’t fit for you because there’s no one way to do grief. Right?

Sophia Wise One 30:08


Joan Price 30:08

I don’t remember the beginning of that sentence.

Sophia Wise One 30:11

It was I loved every word of it. It’s my favorite paragraph, small book sentence. Thank you. Yeah, I so many things came to mind when you said that I’m so I’m so grateful. I’m so grateful for everything you just shared. And I I teared up to I was right there with you. The tears are like, they’re here. You know? And, and, and Robert, do you call him Robert?

Joan Price 30:35

Yes. Yeah.

Sophia Wise One 30:36

Robert. I feel like it’s like, Robert, love to have you here. Thank you for being on the show. Like, it’s very precious, you know, like we want like we want that’s precious to me and to have to have his his continued love. You know, the love that you share, like that’s here that’s here alive. I feel that. I feel that.

Joan Price 30:57

And one of the things I learned through experience, I had been told this, but I didn’t really know it until I’ve learned it through experiences that we can love again. And that doesn’t mean that the love for our beloved is any less or has gone away. But because we have loveliness, we can love more.

Sophia Wise One 31:21

I’m just so I just feel like when you say that, to me, it’s just like, my question was like, tell me something promising Joan, you know, and like that place of like, like, what a great glorious, like, thank you. That’s the feeling. It’s just like thank you universe for like, love making more space for love. That that’s true.

Joan Price 31:41

That’s right. And one of the ways I saw it, is that because I loved Robert. And because Robert loved me so fully, I was my potential for love was expanded to make room for everything he gave me. And to make room for everything that I was able to give to him. And even to others just because I had it in me I was full of love. I was filled with love. Now when he died that love I was filled with didn’t die. I just didn’t have him to focus it on, accepted my fantasies and in my dreams. So when I felt I for fabi pause for that from your side. When I finally felt, I would like to feel a person’s touch again. I would like to hear a man’s voice. I’ve missed a man’s voice. I don’t know if that makes sense. But just hearing. I had lots of friends and they were they were all gendered friends. But just feel that hearing that intimate laughter from being really close to someone and being touched. It’s like my body was yearning to be touched. But also my heart was yearning to be touched. And I didn’t realize that in the beginning, I thought I just want my body touch let me figured out how to do that. And so I went through many ways of figuring out how to do that. And they are all in the book Sex After Grief people if you want to learn about my my friend with benefits and my old lover returning into my life and my first time dates and third dates and you want to read about all that I’m very candid about it. And and that worked for me and, and helped make me whole again helped. I mean, we can’t make another person whole but we can help people repair themselves, I guess.

Sophia Wise One 33:55

Yeah, yeah.

Joan Price 33:56

Into wholeness.

Sophia Wise One 33:57


Joan Price 33:57

And when I felt ready, um, and then I did meet someone that I’ve been with for three and a half years now. He is not a replacement for Robert. He doesn’t want to be I don’t want him to be. He had a great love whom he lost. And I love hearing stories about her. I love knowing her through him and appreciating her. For, for what she she helped him become with the love he he had to give, but also because she was an amazing person in her own right. And mahal, what a gift it is to learn as much as I can about this amazing, amazing woman. And he and and my my partner feels the same way about learning about Robert. And this is just beautiful, that we don’t have to be jealous of a person’s deceased beloved. I so many people have that wrong. And that’s something very important to me to try to convey in my books in my speeches that you don’t you’re not trying to, for people who are dating a griever.

Sophia Wise One 35:18


Joan Price 35:18

You do not, you’re not trying to replace the person that the griever lost, the photos don’t have to come down. The urn doesn’t have to be hidden away. There’s room for you to.

Sophia Wise One 35:39


Joan Price 35:40

How’s that for light at the end of the tunnel?

Sophia Wise One 35:42

Beautiful. That’s beautiful. That’s really beautiful. You said a couple of things about like grief and grieving as a skill and day job. And I just want to say a few things about that for for those who are listening, and I’d be happy to have you add, like anything that comes to mind as we, as we say this. And so one is I have a I have a podcast episode that is about grieving, harvesting, grief for joy, I think is the name of it. And I talk about skills for grieving to how we, how we allow the grief to move through those waves, those cycles that you talk about, you know, that I think about grief, often as a skill. Even more than grieving as a skill, even more than necessarily something that happens to us, but something that is this happening, kind of, I don’t know, with, to and through and from, and learning to be adept at it, because it’s not something that we like get through and then it’s over. And, and, and what came to mind when you were talking both kind of before we’re talking about the skills of grief, and just now the sharing has reminded me of a number of clients that I’ve had over the years and friends that that kind of didn’t know how to grieve, if it was seven or eight years or nine years later, when they came into my life and and began the began the process of re consciously grieving and celebrating and integrating them into their life. And I remember this one client who had a child and, and said it’s her birthday, and I don’t know what to do, all I can think about is how my mother’s not going to be there. And I said, so when everybody gets there light a candle. And yes, and say like, welcome to the party, Mom, you know, invite mom and invite her to the party, you know, and just that that permission of like, they don’t need to be gone. And they don’t. And that will make a little bit of space the freedom to to be our whole selves, right? Because they’re taking up space inside us anyway. And so when we get to let that be honored by those that we’re with, right, then then we’re more holy seen since they’re with us.

Joan Price 38:02

Absolutely, I am. I am lucky enough to have a dance room in my home. I I teach contemporary line dancing. And as as you know, from my history with Robert, we dance was a huge part of what we did together. And he wrote me he put it made a little he he painted a heart and he penciled in over it dancing with you. He gave me that as a card once and I’ve put it on my dance room mirror. And when I start to dance, I touch that I just touch his handwriting. And I see him and I I can’t close my eyes when I dance because it wouldn’t be safe but I try to blur my eyes so that I can see him on the dance floor with me. And it’s a way what you reminded me of that when you talked about inviting mom to the party. I invite Robert to the dance.

Sophia Wise One 39:01

So beautiful. So beautiful. Oh my goodness. Oh, Joan. I obviously adore every second together and I could just I could do this again sometime. And I’m going to move us towards closing here. I have a couple closing questions and and the first one is, you know, people want to be like learn more, you know, your blog, your books, anything. I’ve talked about them already. But is there anything or a particular way that you would like people to get in touch with you or anything that you want people to know about you in the world right now?

Joan Price 39:38

Yes, thank you. Everything is consolidated on my on my website, joanprice.com. joanprice.com, very simple, just my name. And you’ll see you’ll see drop down menus to find my blog and my webinars and books and film I made and everything else you could want to know.

Sophia Wise One 40:00

I just want to bring up again, for anybody, Joan Price does a whole sex toys reviews reference piece. And I just want to say like that we didn’t get into any of this on this show. And all of her resources are there of just like, as we age, different tools and different approaches, it’s just, it’s all there. So whether you want to educate yourself now and your young buck stage, so that you don’t need to be afraid, you just can be prepared, do a little forward study, or whether you’re looking to kind of be more more prepared or reactivating, I just, I thought I just have to say one more thing about this, this grief piece is just, I don’t know, I just if you would speak and I have one closing question after this. But I have one more closing question. So sure, my pre closing question is to speak to that, that that moment for the person who, who’s who’s been grieving. And they’ve come to a place now where they want to, they, they, their body is longing, their heart is longing. They want to take a step, but they don’t know what step to take. What do you have to say to them?

Joan Price 41:08

Well, first, realize that you may not know when you’re ready, you may have moments where you feel ready, and then say you, you go on online dating and you get so discouraged that you crawl back under the covers and cancel your profile. This can happen over and over again. Or you can think I really want to be touched in your, you found somebody that you would like to have touch you. And then as soon as that person does, you burst into tears and run under the covers and hide. There are lots of there’s, there’s no necessarily set time where you go, Okay, this is it. I’m ready now. Okay, putting on my calendar, go out and find someone today. I don’t know that. I don’t know that that will happen that way. However it happens, you’re not doing grief wrong. It’s natural to want something to be in touch with what you desire, without being in touch yet about how to get there. So one of the things to do is to look at just exactly what do you want, is that that you just want to be held by someone, you can take it in stages. You don’t have to say okay, if I want to be touched, that means I have to I have to be ready for penetrative sex, because that’s what this person is going to expect. No, use your words, learn to communicate, learn to say, for example, I have not been with anyone since I lost my beloved. I feel ready to explore. But I don’t know how far I can go. I need it to be all right to take this in stages to stop every few minutes. To have you asked me, “Is this okay? Can we do this?” Consent is not a yes, I will do whatever you want. Consent is a in this moment. I want to do this first thing.

Sophia Wise One 43:17

You’re brilliant, thank you. It’s true. It’s true. It just is. It is. It’s it’s it’s it the simplicity and the power and the life how life changes. It’s powerful time. I call it a grief medicine or death medicine. You know, when Yeah, you know that it grows us it’s big, big, big dosage big, big, an opportunity for healing, right? It doesn’t have to be healing, it can just be devastating and yet all devastation has an invitation to grow us. Joan, Joan, thank you so much for being here. My closing question on Vagina Talks always is I believe that we are all here participating in a rebirth of this planet an evolutionary one, you know, step forward a coming into a bringing into being of of another way of being on this planet in this world. And if you are with me on that, my or even if you’re not, I guess it’s an invitation to would you join me for that for a moment and describe an element of where we’re going like this, this this beautiful world that we’re working towards? What’s there’s a where, where are we going? What’s a part of it that you know that you see that that is whole and well that we want to bring into fullness of being?

Joan Price 44:42

I have so many answers to that, but I’ll choose one or maybe two. One is that after, as as we are recording this more than a year of being isolated by the pandemic and things are starting to maybe maybe open up because we’re getting vaccinated now. I think it is important for us to look through this year. What did I learn about myself? And how I want to be in the world? That wasn’t the same as running on autopilot before we close down? What are the things I do not want to go back to? What are the things simple or hard? Hard might be a job you don’t think you want to go back in the office for easy might be? I don’t think I want to wear makeup or put on a bra. I did fine without it for a year. But maybe to examine before we go back in the world to examine what do we want to go back to? And what are the parts we missed? That maybe we didn’t know, we valued so much. I know part of that will be other people. And part of that will be being out in nature and seeing new things and going new places. But are there other things that you wouldn’t have known, you’d miss so much? Or you wouldn’t have known were part of your life, but you didn’t really want them back. And now that we’re in a transition stage, what can you do to make sure that you don’t just go back on automatic pilot. You know, when we go in the past, when we went on vacations, we’d be in a whole different place and a whole different way of living for, say a week. And we think this has changed my life, I understand so much more. I’m going to go back and everything will be different. We go back two days later, we’re back to where we were before. And we’re looking at pictures and going wow, what was it I wanted to remember from this. We don’t want to have that happen after a year of the pandemic. We want to go back with intention. And we also the other part to what I wanted to say an answer to that. I hope over this year, we’ve done some really good practice on how to talk our how to speak our truths. Not being able to go out on dates not being able to just do mindless social activity, to have to very intentionally adjust our microphone to talk to anyone at all. Maybe that was good for us. Maybe we learned how to listen to people, because you can’t have people talking at once when you’re on zoom. Right? And so maybe we learned some things that we can take forward about how to be with people how to talk to people? And I’m not sure that answers your question. But I hope it gets close.

Sophia Wise One 47:57

I love it. In my like esoteric translation, please. It would be like a world where we like speak our truth and and make choices with great intention.

Joan Price 48:09

Yes, yes. Yes.

Sophia Wise One 48:10

There. Yes. Yes.

Joan Price 48:12

Oh. That’s what I said. Yeah. That’s great. With a few 1000 more words.

Sophia Wise One 48:19

I loved what you said. And it’s such a, you know, the the dream weaving of like that world is that it as it is right? This living with intention and speaking with care of ourselves and each other, and the tool of how we build that world. That’s what you like, that’s what you gave us. You know, like, we we’ve been given this opportunity, if we slow down, and I want to just, you know, offer people if you’re a writer, if and I don’t mean writer, writer, I mean like literally, if you know how to write is what I mean, when I say this, I invite you to, you know, take these questions that Joan’s just asked and answer them. Write them down, like write them down, rewind it right now, this is a podcast, you can do that, rewind it, write those down, ask yourself those questions. And if you don’t have an answer right away, give yourself a couple days, give yourself a couple weeks to say what are some of these things little or big that I do want that I have new value for that I want more of one of the things that I’m willing to say, you know what, when I move forward, I’m really going to do differently because that change that shift that being in the world differently, we that’s we got to participate in that if not momentum and habit will always take the way. And we have such an opportunity in that habit and momentum being interrupted. And yet, we will still take intention when it when that cultural machine turns back on to be the director of force like we get to do that individually and to be supportive of those around us who are attempting to do that. I think that’s the part I want to really bring in here is that you’re not the only one who wants to live that differently now. And so how can we be proactive in supporting those around us that we know and love, even if we don’t know and love their choices? And those that we don’t know to make those new choices and and move forward with authenticity in their life.

Joan Price 50:06

I love what you said I love every word. And to add to that, for my age group very often, people of my age or a little younger, a little older, think it’s too late to make major change. It’s too late to leave my job. It’s too late to get a divorce. It’s too late to kick my son out of the house or whatever, it might be a hard choice, hard choice. You may think it’s just too late. Or how do I know what’s after that? Maybe this is good. It’s good as it’s gonna get. And I can’t make your decision for you. But I will ask you to look at it this way. If not now, when?

Sophia Wise One 50:49

Joan Price, everybody. Thank you so much for listening to Vagina Talks. I am so grateful to have you here and have your listening. If you don’t know already. This podcast is up and running. Go ahead and hit follow wherever you listen. Check out, go check out Joan’s work, check out other episodes. Like I said, I got that grief episode and other things. And I have one more event that’s coming up that I’d love to have you know about actually, my connection to Joan Price. Imagine is putting on together a fire woman retreat. It’s an online retreat, and it’s about spirituality and sexuality. And that’s coming up in May. And there’s a link in the show notes. If you want to learn some more practices around spirituality and sexuality, please go click that link. I will be supporting a couple moments of that event and I’m excited always excited to to work with her. And oh my gosh, I just I’m just an in love. I’m in a I’m in that I’m in that love pool. I’m in that filled with love. Joan, thank you for your wisdom, for your courage, for your beauty, for your grace. Just an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much. Thank you.

Joan Price 52:02

Thank you and may we all swim in the love pool.

Sophia Wise One 52:05

Swimming in the love pool, my loves. Do do me a favor, drink some water do one thing that feels really really good for you tonight. And this morning or wherever it is you may be choose one thing that feels good. And just go ahead and give it to yourself. All right, take care.

Samantha Rise 52:25

Thank you so much for listening.

Sophia Wise One 52:26

Thank you so much. And thank you, Sam.

Samantha Rise 52:29

Thank you, Sophia.

Sophia Wise One 52:33

Remember, everything that we talked about in today’s episode will be in the show notes. So go there for links.

Samantha Rise 52:39

For more content that you’re going to love, subscribe, subscribe, to subscribe to this podcast. share this episode with anybody think you’ll enjoy it and share the love with rate review wherever you listen.

Sophia Wise One 52:50

And to find out about all the mad adventures I’m up to, check me out on Instagram at Sophia Wise One or come to my website sophiawiseonecom. I am Sophia Wise One, daughter of the wind. I am calling you to rise up, rise up, rise up. Rise up and take your place. Thank you gorgeous. I am thrilled and grateful for your support listening to this podcast. I want to invite you to come check out the Patreon. If you think this podcast is the bee’s nails and you’re grateful that it exists. I want you to know I’m grateful that you exist. Come join the Patreon, I call it the temple. We are healing we are music gang, we are podcasting, we are together. Come, check it out. You can find it through patreon/sophiawiseone or through my website sophiawiseone.com.

Samantha Rise 54:02

Now, you need to hear that though. You know. If you don’t know.

Sophia Wise One 54:07

If you don’t know.

Samantha Rise 54:08

Okay. Now, I’m so excited about for Vagina Talks right now. Don’t pretend like you don’t know this is the best podcast you’ve ever listened to. Don’t pretend like you don’t know. You know.